Gun Control

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 02:31 PM

This discussion began in a thread about kids, and it just seemed wrong to continue discussing it in there.

I posted that I believe handguns should be banned, except for police and military use, and leave rifles including assault rifles legal. Handguns serve only one purpose, to kill people. While rifles, especially assault rifles, can still be used to kill people, they are used less often in crimes and accidental shootings (I will post statistical data later if needed). A rifle is very difficult to conceal, even a sawed off shotgun. I once saw a sawed off shotgun that was less than a foot long with a pistol grip. Sure it could be concealed, but good luck shooting it without breaking your arm!!!

And the debate involving gun control always comes back to "The right to bear arms". I believe that we do have the right to bear arms, just not handguns. If we had the right to own whatever arms we wanted to, we could have missiles and rocket launchers. It only seems right to ban weapons and firearms that do more harm then good.

**Sekretgardengal** · 02-03-2007, 02:36 PM

It really is kinda this way or that about handguns. If we don't have them to protect ourselves in our own homes then the criminals can have them to kill us.
We have handguns in our home and raised three children and made sure that the guns were locked up and the children had no chance of getting to them.
It's really up to the adults to put the guns under lock and key so no child is ever killed by an accidental shooting. If you need to get to that gun for a safety reason, then make it where it is accessible for the adult to get it.
Also, children should be taught about gun safety.

I dunno, it really all depends on the person/s that have these handguns.
They need to use their heads when having one in the home.

**MyAzi** · 02-03-2007, 02:44 PM

I have to agree... and have a ton to say on this so I will have to come back to it!

**Sekretgardengal** · 02-03-2007, 02:46 PM

My, which way do you think? Having them or not??

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 03:06 PM

The vast majority that have hand guns target shoot myself included others have them for other reasons. they are easer to conceal so is a knife or club. sawed off are illegal all shotguns half to have a certain beral length if caught shorter your in big trouble
Fully auto assault gun you need a federal firearms permit if caught shooting one without it’s 10 years In jail do not pass go. The only way to shoot one is at a range were the range has a special permit . pdx did you have a permit? Secret is right they need to be locked up. Unfortunately some of the adults who own guns are just not responsible enough an you have accidents an they wonder what went wrong. Bottom line if you
Don’t respect them they will bite.

**Sekretgardengal** · 02-03-2007, 03:16 PM

That is so true George. People need to be smart.

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curious George

The vast majority that have hand guns target shoot myself included others have them for other reasons. they are easer to conceal so is a knife or club. sawed off are illegal all shotguns half to have a certain beral length if caught shorter your in big trouble
Fully auto assault gun you need a federal firearms permit if caught shooting one without it’s 10 years In jail do not pass go. The only way to shoot one is at a range were the range has a special permit . pdx did you have a permit? Secret is right they need to be locked up. Unfortunately some of the adults who own guns are just not responsible enough an you have accidents an they wonder what went wrong. Bottom line if you
Don’t respect them they will bite.

It is semi auto, no permit needed. It is a russian SKS, which I really don't consider an "assault weapon", but the ATF does.

**Sekretgardengal** · 02-03-2007, 03:31 PM

eek! a semi auto. What the heck do ya need that for?

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sekretgardengal

It really is kinda this way or that about handguns. If we don't have them to protect ourselves in our own homes then the criminals can have them to kill us.
We have handguns in our home and raised three children and made sure that the guns were locked up and the children had no chance of getting to them.
It's really up to the adults to put the guns under lock and key so no child is ever killed by an accidental shooting. If you need to get to that gun for a safety reason, then make it where it is accessible for the adult to get it.
Also, children should be taught about gun safety.

I dunno, it really all depends on the person/s that have these handguns.
They need to use their heads when having one in the home.

You can easily defend your home and family with a rifle just as easily as a handgun, and even easier with a short barrelled (but legal) shotgun.

It is easy to say that if people were smart there would be no problems..... you are not getting the point. Handgns are used for crimes!!! Not all people are smart and guns shoot themselves or others!!! Criminals steal guns, and then use them to commit more crimes or to kill people!!!! Handguns do nothing but cause problems. I am sure if grenades were legal, and most people would keep them safe and not hurt themselves or others with them. But there would be a few who would end up hurting themselves and others. Just because the majority of people would use them wisely, should we legalize hand grenades? Hell no!!!!

**Sekretgardengal** · 02-03-2007, 03:35 PM

Ok, I understand where you are coming from. I just feel that I can handle a handgun better than a riffle. A riffle is hard to hide too.

**Wyoming53** · 02-03-2007, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

It is semi auto, no permit needed. It is a russian SKS, which I really don't consider an "assault weapon", but the ATF does.

No the ATF does not consider it an assault rifle. in 1968 the ATF and the Federal gov wrote some laws. they defined an "Assault Weapon" as that weapon with a selectable rate of fire, including full auto". So nobody considers it an "Assault Weapon".

Pistols have their place. No, they weren't designed to kill people. They were designed as a tool. Mine have never jumped off the table and killed anybody.

As far as law enforcement and military having them, and not me. That's just plain wrong. 2nd amendment garantees me the right. When it was written it was written to give us that right so the tyranny of government couldn't take over. Law Enforcement and military are the gov. If they can have them, I can have them.

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

It is semi auto, no permit needed. It is a russian SKS, which I really don't consider an "assault weapon", but the ATF does.

Epa considers fiberglass toxic waist to. my son has an ak 47 semi auto he would like to get a sks. Secret a lot of guns are semi auto there just nicer to fire the gun dose all the work you just keep shooting semi auto has been around for a long time .

**Sekretgardengal** · 02-03-2007, 03:41 PM

eek! I hate guns but still feel safe with the one my DH has.

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyoming53

No the ATF does not consider it an assault rifle. in 1968 the ATF and the Federal gov wrote some laws. they defined an "Assault Weapon" as that weapon with a selectable rate of fire, including full auto". So nobody considers it an "Assault Weapon".

Pistols have their place. No, they weren't designed to kill people. They were designed as a tool. Mine have never jumped off the table and killed anybody.

As far as law enforcement and military having them, and not me. That's just plain wrong. 2nd amendment garantees me the right. When it was written it was written to give us that right so the tyranny of government couldn't take over. Law Enforcement and military are the gov. If they can have them, I can have them.

It said arms, not handguns. Plus, if you wanted to overthrow the government, would you want to do it with a 6 shooter, or semi automatic AK-47 or SKS with a bannana clip?

**Wyoming53** · 02-03-2007, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

It said arms, not handguns. Plus, if you wanted to overthrow the government, would you want to do it with a 6 shooter, or semi automatic AK-47 or SKS with a bannana clip?

both

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

It said arms, not handguns. Plus, if you wanted to overthrow the government, would you want to do it with a 6 shooter, or semi automatic AK-47 or SKS with a bannana clip?

Come on pdx he never said anything about overthrowing anything ,just stated 2nd amendment an I agree with him .

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 03:52 PM

How big is your banana clip

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyoming53

No the ATF does not consider it an assault rifle. in 1968 the ATF and the Federal gov wrote some laws. they defined an "Assault Weapon" as that weapon with a selectable rate of fire, including full auto". So nobody considers it an "Assault Weapon".

Pistols have their place. No, they weren't designed to kill people. They were designed as a tool. Mine have never jumped off the table and killed anybody.

As far as law enforcement and military having them, and not me. That's just plain wrong. 2nd amendment garantees me the right. When it was written it was written to give us that right so the tyranny of government couldn't take over. Law Enforcement and military are the gov. If they can have them, I can have them.

But they do consider it an "Assault weapon".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_weapon

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curious George

Come on pdx he never said anything about overthrowing anything ,just stated 2nd amendment an I agree with him .

That is the point of the 2nd Amendment.

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

That is the point of the 2nd Amendment.

To keep them from not to start his own
My son says the sks is not considered assault it’s semi auto
One bad feature is fixed clip way to slow for reload you just can’t change them out sa fast like others

**T.S.** · 02-03-2007, 04:08 PM

Handguns are also used by hunters. If you wound a deer, track it, and find it wounded but still alive, you don't want to put a .30-06 round or 12 gauge slug in it at close range.

**Wyoming53** · 02-03-2007, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

But they do consider it an "Assault weapon".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_weapon

Sorry to say, that wiki definition came straight out of Diane Fiensteins speach. The ATF and FED GOV most certainly have a definition and I stated it above.

California further defined "Assault" as any look alike. So California considers my AR-15 an Assault rifle. But the Fed's don't.

Magazines? I have 4 40 round, 4 30 round, and the completely stupid 10 round it came with. Guess I could use it for hunting. But that's not what I bought that rifle for.

**Wyoming53** · 02-03-2007, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T.S.

Handguns are also used by hunters. If you wound a deer, track it, and find it wounded but still alive, you don't want to put a .30-06 round or 12 gauge slug in it at close range.

A few years ago, I took two antelop and two deer with my pistol. Not because they were wounded either. haha My next challenge is to get my elk with my pistol. If I'm successful, I'm putting in for a bear tag and will try that.

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 04:19 PM

My son takes my 44 magnum with him now a days he was dear hunting up north camping in a tent next morning there was bear tracks in there camp sight he remembers something rubbing against the tent that night . now he won’t leave home without it. he also likes gps now days.

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyoming53

Sorry to say, that wiki definition came straight out of Diane Fiensteins speach. The ATF and FED GOV most certainly have a definition and I stated it above.

California further defined "Assault" as any look alike. So California considers my AR-15 an Assault rifle. But the Fed's don't.

Magazines? I have 4 40 round, 4 30 round, and the completely stupid 10 round it came with. Guess I could use it for hunting. But that's not what I bought that rifle for.

An "Assault Rifle" is defined as having selective fire, while an "assualt weapon" is a semi-automatic weapon designed to kill people. I have had this debate before and I found the info on the ATF site which proves this, but I have not had time to go find it again. So, if you don't beleive me, prove otherwise.

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T.S.

Handguns are also used by hunters. If you wound a deer, track it, and find it wounded but still alive, you don't want to put a .30-06 round or 12 gauge slug in it at close range.

You still don't NEED a handgun for hunting. Nobody, except police and military, NEEDS a handgun. I am sure you can come up with a 100 reasons why you NEED a handgun, but there is just as many reasons, if not more, on why you don't.

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

An "Assault Rifle" is defined as having selective fire, while an "assualt weapon" is a semi-automatic weapon designed to kill people. I have had this debate before and I found the info on the ATF site which proves this, but I have not had time to go find it again. So, if you don't beleive me, prove otherwise.

So what your saying in a revolver from the old west an a pump shotgun would be considered a assault weapon. Were would a dabble barrel shotgun fit in

**PDXnative** · 02-03-2007, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curious George

So what your saying in a revolver from the old west an a pump shotgun would be considered a assault weapon. Were would a dabble barrel shotgun fit in

Those aren't semi-auto military weapons.

**T.S.** · 02-03-2007, 05:49 PM

Do you really think that criminals would follow a handgun ban? They don't follow other laws. All a ban would do is take them away from law abiding citizens while criminals would still find a source to get them if they want them. Cocaine is illegal, but that doesn't keep criminals from getting their hands on it.

Curious George · 02-03-2007, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PDXnative

Those aren't semi-auto military weapons.

Well if they half to be military there’s allot that aren’t . an if you knew anything about guns you would know ammo is what makes some of them special an that opens up a whole nether can of worms an some of that ammo can be used in non military non assault weapons. You can take any gun an modify the ammo to get the desired effect . you should know more about guns. then to say all pistols are bad they kill people theses are remarks of a one size fits all mentality very short sided.

02-03-2007, 02:31 PM	#1 (permalink)
PDXnative Omnipotent Join Date: Jan 16th, 2007 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 2,225	Gun Control This discussion began in a thread about kids, and it just seemed wrong to continue discussing it in there. I posted that I believe handguns should be banned, except for police and military use, and leave rifles including assault rifles legal. Handguns serve only one purpose, to kill people. While rifles, especially assault rifles, can still be used to kill people, they are used less often in crimes and accidental shootings (I will post statistical data later if needed). A rifle is very difficult to conceal, even a sawed off shotgun. I once saw a sawed off shotgun that was less than a foot long with a pistol grip. Sure it could be concealed, but good luck shooting it without breaking your arm!!! And the debate involving gun control always comes back to "The right to bear arms". I believe that we do have the right to bear arms, just not handguns. If we had the right to own whatever arms we wanted to, we could have missiles and rocket launchers. It only seems right to ban weapons and firearms that do more harm then good. __________________ Who put the alphabet in alphabetical order?

02-03-2007, 02:36 PM	#2 (permalink)
Sekretgardengal Hi guys, I am here! Join Date: Nov 30th, 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,111	Re: Gun Control It really is kinda this way or that about handguns. If we don't have them to protect ourselves in our own homes then the criminals can have them to kill us. We have handguns in our home and raised three children and made sure that the guns were locked up and the children had no chance of getting to them. It's really up to the adults to put the guns under lock and key so no child is ever killed by an accidental shooting. If you need to get to that gun for a safety reason, then make it where it is accessible for the adult to get it. Also, children should be taught about gun safety. I dunno, it really all depends on the person/s that have these handguns. They need to use their heads when having one in the home. __________________ I am back!

02-03-2007, 02:44 PM	#3 (permalink)
MyAzi Slave to Sir Azi Join Date: Jan 14th, 2007 Location: Western Washington Posts: 1,303	Re: Gun Control I have to agree... and have a ton to say on this so I will have to come back to it! __________________ FEEL THE FEAR AND DO IT ANYWAY

02-03-2007, 02:46 PM	#4 (permalink)
Sekretgardengal Hi guys, I am here! Join Date: Nov 30th, 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,111	Re: Gun Control My, which way do you think? Having them or not?? __________________ I am back!

02-03-2007, 03:06 PM	#5 (permalink)
Curious George Banned Join Date: Jan 08th, 2007 Location: Minnesota Posts: 972	Re: Gun Control The vast majority that have hand guns target shoot myself included others have them for other reasons. they are easer to conceal so is a knife or club. sawed off are illegal all shotguns half to have a certain beral length if caught shorter your in big trouble Fully auto assault gun you need a federal firearms permit if caught shooting one without it’s 10 years In jail do not pass go. The only way to shoot one is at a range were the range has a special permit . pdx did you have a permit? Secret is right they need to be locked up. Unfortunately some of the adults who own guns are just not responsible enough an you have accidents an they wonder what went wrong. Bottom line if you Don’t respect them they will bite.

02-03-2007, 03:16 PM	#6 (permalink)
Sekretgardengal Hi guys, I am here! Join Date: Nov 30th, 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,111	Re: Gun Control That is so true George. People need to be smart. __________________ I am back!

02-03-2007, 03:31 PM	#8 (permalink)
Sekretgardengal Hi guys, I am here! Join Date: Nov 30th, 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,111	Re: Gun Control eek! a semi auto. What the heck do ya need that for? __________________ I am back!

02-03-2007, 03:35 PM	#10 (permalink)
Sekretgardengal Hi guys, I am here! Join Date: Nov 30th, 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,111	Re: Gun Control Ok, I understand where you are coming from. I just feel that I can handle a handgun better than a riffle. A riffle is hard to hide too. __________________ I am back!

02-03-2007, 03:41 PM	#13 (permalink)
Sekretgardengal Hi guys, I am here! Join Date: Nov 30th, 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,111	Re: Gun Control eek! I hate guns but still feel safe with the one my DH has. __________________ I am back!

02-03-2007, 03:52 PM	#17 (permalink)
Curious George Banned Join Date: Jan 08th, 2007 Location: Minnesota Posts: 972	Re: Gun Control How big is your banana clip

02-03-2007, 04:08 PM	#21 (permalink)
T.S. Member Join Date: Oct 12th, 2006 Location: MN to NC to FL to MN Posts: 753	Re: Gun Control Handguns are also used by hunters. If you wound a deer, track it, and find it wounded but still alive, you don't want to put a .30-06 round or 12 gauge slug in it at close range.

02-03-2007, 04:19 PM	#24 (permalink)
Curious George Banned Join Date: Jan 08th, 2007 Location: Minnesota Posts: 972	Re: Gun Control My son takes my 44 magnum with him now a days he was dear hunting up north camping in a tent next morning there was bear tracks in there camp sight he remembers something rubbing against the tent that night . now he won’t leave home without it. he also likes gps now days.

02-03-2007, 05:49 PM	#29 (permalink)
T.S. Member Join Date: Oct 12th, 2006 Location: MN to NC to FL to MN Posts: 753	Re: Gun Control Do you really think that criminals would follow a handgun ban? They don't follow other laws. All a ban would do is take them away from law abiding citizens while criminals would still find a source to get them if they want them. Cocaine is illegal, but that doesn't keep criminals from getting their hands on it.